• TRS-80 Model 102

    From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to All on Fri Apr 2 09:35:10 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <6066D73E.25490.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: 9000
    Testing on a TRS-80 Model 102 Portable Computer!

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Zouf on Sat Apr 3 06:45:53 2021
    @VIA: BBSESINF
    @MSGID: <60685571.4107.dove-gen@bbses.info>
    @REPLY: <6066D73E.25490.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c168
    Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Zouf to All on Fri Apr 02 2021 09:35 am

    Testing on a TRS-80 Model 102 Portable Computer!

    good for you
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From multiplemiggs@VERT/BTTMLSS to Zouf on Sat Apr 3 23:24:00 2021
    @VIA: BTTMLSS
    @MSGID: <60693165.118344.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    On 02 Apr 2021, Zouf said the following...

    Testing on a TRS-80 Model 102 Portable Computer!

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!

    Thats very cool. How are you connected, through a WIFI-232?
    I want to do this with my HP-100LX one of these days.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to MRO on Sun Apr 4 01:26:41 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <606907C1.25519.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <60685571.4107.dove-gen@bbses.info>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: MRO to Zouf on Sat Apr 03 2021 06:45 am

    Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Zouf to All on Fri Apr 02 2021 09:35 am

    Testing on a TRS-80 Model 102 Portable Computer!

    good for you


    Thanks!

    :-)

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Zouf on Fri Apr 2 10:02:00 2021
    @VIA: REALITY
    @MSGID: <606911EC.47087.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @REPLY: <6066D73E.25490.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c1e0
    Zouf wrote to All <=-

    Testing on a TRS-80 Model 102 Portable Computer!

    Awesome! I always loved those little things, wanted to take one to a coffee shop to do my writing.

    Did you post on r/retrobattlestations? There's a picture of a pristine 102 posting to a BBS there this morning.

    If only you could create a QWK reader in BASIC, but you wouldn't have enough room left over for a mail packet!


    ... Into the impossible
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    Synchronet realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to multiplemiggs on Sun Apr 4 15:14:41 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <6069C9D1.25529.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <60693165.118344.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: multiplemiggs to Zouf on Sat Apr 03 2021 11:24 pm

    On 02 Apr 2021, Zouf said the following...

    Testing on a TRS-80 Model 102 Portable Computer!

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and P

    Thats very cool. How are you connected, through a WIFI-232?
    I want to do this with my HP-100LX one of these days.


    Yes, my connection is through CBM's WiModem-232 which I believe is the easiest method of getting vintage computers online nowadays. The TRS-80 Portable Computer also has a built in terminal programme which makes going online very straight forward.


    Good luck in getting your little palmtop HP-100LX online! :-)

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From multiplemiggs@VERT/BTTMLSS to Zouf on Sun Apr 4 16:34:00 2021
    @VIA: BTTMLSS
    @MSGID: <606A22DF.118358.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    Yes, my connection is through CBM's WiModem-232 which I believe is the eas method of getting vintage computers online nowadays. The TRS-80 Portable Computer also has a built in terminal programme which makes going online v straight forward.


    Good luck in getting your little palmtop HP-100LX online! :-)

    Yeah, it was a pretty neat system in its time with a built in terminal and
    the probably the most compact acoustic coupler ever made.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to poindexter FORTRAN on Sun Apr 4 23:39:31 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <606A4023.25539.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <606911EC.47087.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Zouf on Fri Apr 02 2021 10:02 am

    Zouf wrote to All <=-

    Testing on a TRS-80 Model 102 Portable Computer!

    Awesome! I always loved those little things, wanted to take one to a coffee shop to do my writing.

    Did you post on r/retrobattlestations? There's a picture of a pristine 102 posting to a BBS there this morning.

    If only you could create a QWK reader in BASIC, but you wouldn't have enough room left over for a mail packet!


    ... Into the impossible


    They're great computers to write on. The keyboard is excellent for an old all-in-one system from the mid-80's. I can see why they were so popular with journalists. I saw a short video on YouTube from The Verge featuring a TRS-80 Model 100 belonging to former Wall St Journal writer Walt Mossberg. He said he loved writing pieces on it due to the portability, usability and network capability. It must've felt quite futuristic writing an article in 1983 and transmitting it to your editor, cross state, using the built in 300 baud modem.

    Good spot, yes, I did post on r/retrobattlestations and I am using the same machine to reply to you now! I don't have a 6v charger so I am running it off of 4 AA batteries which is said to provide around 14 hours of usage.

    I know, there is only 24k of space in this particular model, which is not really much for anything. I am using it to BBS purely for novelty purposes until the batteries run low, then I'll probably move onto a more suitable machine.

    But damn, this really is a joy to type on.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to multiplemiggs on Mon Apr 5 00:09:28 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <606A4728.25542.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <606A22DF.118358.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: multiplemiggs to Zouf on Sun Apr 04 2021 04:34 pm

    Yeah, it was a pretty neat system in its time with a built in terminal and the probably the most compact acoustic coupler ever made.


    Those acoustic couplers are mind boggling. I only discovered them several months ago when I saw a video on YouTube of a guy dialling into a BBS with acoustic couplers on a Commodore PET. I didn't know it was a viable method of getting on the internet!

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Zouf on Mon Apr 5 18:50:00 2021
    @VIA: FREEWAY
    @MSGID: <606AD869.26212.dove-general@freeway.apana.org.au>
    @REPLY: <6066D73E.25490.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: 1258
    On 04-02-21 09:35, Zouf wrote to All <=-

    @VIA: VERT/AMSTRAD
    Testing on a TRS-80 Model 102 Portable Computer!

    It's working. :)


    ... Ask not for whom the bell tolls; let the machine get it.
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
    Synchronet Freeway BBS, Bendigo Australia. freeway.apana.org.au
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to Zouf on Mon Apr 5 08:35:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <606B07D5.51739.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <606A4023.25539.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c12c
    Zouf wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    I know, there is only 24k of space in this particular model, which is
    not really much for anything.

    But its max is 32K. But between the built-in software and the fact that the data formats tend to be VERY lean, 32K is plenty for that system.

    And if you need more, they made a portable floppy drive too. Several of us have re-created that using modern hardware.

    But damn, this really is a joy to type on.

    Those old computers had really nice keyboards. The layout was... interesting...on some of them, but they were nice to type on.


    ... Cross river *THEN* insult alligator.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Vk3jed on Mon Apr 5 11:35:28 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <606AE7F0.25554.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <606AD869.26212.dove-general@freeway.apana.org.au>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Vk3jed to Zouf on Mon Apr 05 2021 06:50 pm

    On 04-02-21 09:35, Zouf wrote to All <=-

    @VIA: VERT/AMSTRAD
    Testing on a TRS-80 Model 102 Portable Computer!

    It's working. :)


    ... Ask not for whom the bell tolls; let the machine get it.

    It's as slow as hell but it works :-).

    There's something nice about browsing Dove-Net on a TRS-80 whilst having your morning coffee.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Ogg@VERT/CAPCITY2 to Zouf on Mon Apr 5 08:03:00 2021
    @VIA: CAPCITY2
    @MSGID: <606AFC8C.53824.dove-gen@capitolcityonline.net>
    @REPLY: <606A4728.25542.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: ff10
    Hello Zouf!

    ** On Monday 05.04.21 - 00:09, Zouf wrote to multiplemiggs:

    Those acoustic couplers are mind boggling. I only discovered them several months ago when I saw a video on YouTube of a guy dialling into a BBS with acoustic couplers on a Commodore PET. I didn't know it was a viable method of getting on the internet!

    OH! Such a young one here. :D

    I have typewriters out on display as decor in my shop. Young
    kids are totally amazed at watching the mechanics and all the
    moving parts.


    --- OpenXP 5.0.49
    * Origin: Ogg's Dovenet Point (723:320/1.9)
    Synchronet CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Dr. What on Tue Apr 6 03:19:20 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <606BC528.25566.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <606B07D5.51739.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Dr. What to Zouf on Mon Apr 05 2021 08:35 am

    Zouf wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    I know, there is only 24k of space in this particular model, which is not really much for anything.

    But its max is 32K. But between the built-in software and the fact that the data formats tend to be VERY lean, 32K is plenty for that system.

    And if you need more, they made a portable floppy drive too. Several of us have re-created that using modern hardware.

    But damn, this really is a joy to type on.

    Those old computers had really nice keyboards. The layout was... interesting...on some of them, but they were nice to type on.


    ... Cross river *THEN* insult alligator.

    I have no experience or idea how to program so I don't have much of a concept of space in regards to vintage computers, 24K sounds meagre but I guess it must have been enough for most users back then.

    The keyboards on older systems seem to feel more tactile and solid than the standard (non-mechanical) keyboards in the present day. Perhaps they just have a better build quality.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Ogg on Tue Apr 6 03:34:12 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <606BC8A4.25567.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <606AFC8C.53824.dove-gen@capitolcityonline.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Ogg to Zouf on Mon Apr 05 2021 08:03 am

    Hello Zouf!

    ** On Monday 05.04.21 - 00:09, Zouf wrote to multiplemiggs:

    Those acoustic couplers are mind boggling. I only discovered them severa months ago when I saw a video on YouTube of a guy dialling into a BBS wi acoustic couplers on a Commodore PET. I didn't know it was a viable meth of getting on the internet!

    OH! Such a young one here. :D

    I have typewriters out on display as decor in my shop. Young
    kids are totally amazed at watching the mechanics and all the
    moving parts.



    I think acoustic couplers give you a more illustrative idea of how data is transmitted from one device to another through a telephone line. Even though they look absolutely archaic, they appear to run at 300 baud which is just useable for basic BBSing and data transfer. My Tandy 102 is running at 300 baud right now :-).

    Old typewriters are awesome! I don't own one but it would be pretty cool to have a working one as an ornament in the house.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to Zouf on Tue Apr 6 09:18:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <606C68E2.51780.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <606BC528.25566.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c12c
    Zouf wrote to Dr. What <=-

    I have no experience or idea how to program so I don't have much of a concept of space in regards to vintage computers, 24K sounds meagre but
    I guess it must have been enough for most users back then.

    In that era, the norm was 16K. Smaller systems had only 8K.
    "Beefy" PCs had 32K. But that would quickly increase to 64K and 128K and finally to 640K - which was enough for anyone (according to Bill Gates).

    The keyboards on older systems seem to feel more tactile and solid than the standard (non-mechanical) keyboards in the present day. Perhaps
    they just have a better build quality.

    That's just the way they built keyboard back then. There really wasn't
    any other technology.

    I have a Kaypro 4/83, Commodore PET, Commodore 64, TRS-80 Model 4P and they all had the same style mechanical keyboards. Even my more modern Tandy
    1400LT had one. But my Tandy 1100FD doesn't.

    But the main issue with the older keyboard was layout. Some of the layouts were strange - especially the Commodore PET keyboard.


    ... Proofread carefully to see if you any words out!
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From multiplemiggs@VERT/BTTMLSS to Zouf on Tue Apr 6 23:22:00 2021
    @VIA: BTTMLSS
    @MSGID: <606D2574.118423.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    On 05 Apr 2021, Zouf said the following...

    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: multiplemiggs to Zouf on Sun Apr 04 2021 04:34 pm

    Yeah, it was a pretty neat system in its time with a built in terminal the probably the most compact acoustic coupler ever made.


    Those acoustic couplers are mind boggling. I only discovered them several months ago when I saw a video on YouTube of a guy dialling into a BBS with acoustic couplers on a Commodore PET. I didn't know it was a viable method getting on the internet!

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!

    They are surprising how well they work. I found a few schematics online for Acoustic Couplers and I'm thinking of building one. I would like to make a really compact unit like the one for the TRS-80 102 for my HP-100lx.
    I have a PCMCIA card modem for it, but they pretty much wipe out a set of AA batteries in a few minutes, and the other disadvantage is that I would need a actual phone line to plug into. With an Acoustic Coupler I can connect to a
    pay phone if I wanted to. And if it has it's own power source I can still
    keep my battery life on the palmtop.

    I don't know but I think that the TRS-80 102 had some of the acoustic coupler hardware built into the computer.
    Does yours have a another port outside of a regular RS-232?

    There is a few IC chips that were pretty much a modem on a chip, and there's one that runs at 300 baud which would be prefect for a acoustic coupler.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From multiplemiggs@VERT/BTTMLSS to Dr. What on Tue Apr 6 23:50:00 2021
    @VIA: BTTMLSS
    @MSGID: <606D2C2C.118425.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    I have a Kaypro 4/83, Commodore PET, Commodore 64, TRS-80 Model 4P and the all had the same style mechanical keyboards. Even my more modern Tandy 1400LT had one. But my Tandy 1100FD doesn't.

    But the main issue with the older keyboard was layout. Some of the layout were strange - especially the Commodore PET keyboard.


    ... Proofread carefully to see if you any words out!
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksbur
    I have a PET 2001 8k and a 4016.
    I'll agree the PET is a strange keyboard layout. Every time I use it for any length of time and use a standard IBM layout I'm heading to the top right of the number pad, reaching for the backspace key.
    The one thing I do love is the top row of keys all usable without using the shift key. I find it nice for BASIC. Quotation marks, $, %, *, (), all accessible with one press.

    The chicklet keyboard take a bit to get used to but actually isn't
    that bad considering the size.

    My favorite keyboard of all time is the IBM clicky Model M.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Zouf on Wed Apr 7 19:04:00 2021
    @VIA: FREEWAY
    @MSGID: <606D83E4.26272.dove-general@freeway.apana.org.au>
    @REPLY: <606AE7F0.25554.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: 1258
    On 04-05-21 11:35, Zouf wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    It's as slow as hell but it works :-).

    Haha what baud rate are you using?

    There's something nice about browsing Dove-Net on a TRS-80 whilst
    having your morning coffee.

    That's pretty cool actually. :)


    ... Politics = Poly(many) + tics(blood sucking parasites)
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
    Synchronet Freeway BBS, Bendigo Australia. freeway.apana.org.au
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Ogg on Tue Apr 6 06:56:00 2021
    @VIA: REALITY
    @MSGID: <606DAD52.47178.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @REPLY: <606AFC8C.53824.dove-gen@capitolcityonline.net>
    @TZ: c1e0
    Ogg wrote to Zouf <=-

    I have typewriters out on display as decor in my shop. Young
    kids are totally amazed at watching the mechanics and all the
    moving parts.

    A local book store had an old manual typewriter (the same one I used in High School) and a deck of brown paper 5x7 cards. Kids were encouraged to type haikus (or any poem) on the cards and post them.

    The kids were enthralled with the workings of a typewriter.


    ... A closed system lacks the ability to renew itself.
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    Synchronet realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Zouf on Tue Apr 6 06:57:00 2021
    @VIA: REALITY
    @MSGID: <606DAD52.47179.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @REPLY: <606BC8A4.25567.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c1e0
    Zouf wrote to Ogg <=-

    I think acoustic couplers give you a more illustrative idea of how data
    is transmitted from one device to another through a telephone line.
    Even though they look absolutely archaic, they appear to run at 300
    baud which is just useable for basic BBSing and data transfer. My Tandy 102 is running at 300 baud right now :-).

    300 baud was always considered to be about the speed you read at - so you could read along well at 300 baud.

    I used to use 300 baud (and 110 baud) on paper teletypes used with old phone systems, and I can attest to that. It was a comfortable speed to read along without falling behind.


    ... A closed system lacks the ability to renew itself.
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    Synchronet realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to multiplemiggs on Wed Apr 7 10:17:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <606DC490.51808.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <606D2C2C.118425.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    @TZ: c12c
    multiplemiggs wrote to Dr. What <=-

    I have a PET 2001 8k and a 4016.
    I'll agree the PET is a strange keyboard layout. Every time I use it
    for any length of time and use a standard IBM layout I'm heading to the top right of the number pad, reaching for the backspace key.

    Ya, it sometimes hurts my head (and fingers). Maybe that's why I don't use
    my PET 4032 very often.

    The one thing I do love is the top row of keys all usable without using the shift key. I find it nice for BASIC. Quotation marks, $, %, *, (),
    all accessible with one press.

    Yes, that was nice. I remember back in High School being able to type BASIC programs in pretty much as fast as I could write the code in my head because
    of that.

    The chicklet keyboard take a bit to get used to but actually isn't
    that bad considering the size.

    No, but it's certainly a "hunt and peck" type of keyboard. Touch typists always cringed when they saw that keyboard.

    My favorite keyboard of all time is the IBM clicky Model M.

    I can understand that. The keyboards I use for normal work are all like
    that - just more modern.


    ... Don't even TRY to THINK without proper tools.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to multiplemiggs on Wed Apr 7 10:25:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <606DC490.51809.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <606D2574.118423.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    @TZ: c12c
    multiplemiggs wrote to Zouf <=-

    I don't know but I think that the TRS-80 102 had some of the acoustic coupler hardware built into the computer.

    Look on the back of the 102 and you'll see 2 round ports. One is marked "phone". That's the built in 300 BPS modem. They probably made an acoustic coupler
    setup that plugs directly into that port.

    I know that they made a modular phone cable that plugged into it.


    ... *IT IS* documented, look under "For Internal Use Only."
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Dr. What on Wed Apr 7 06:06:00 2021
    @VIA: REALITY
    @MSGID: <606DEE5D.47186.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @REPLY: <606C68E2.51780.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: c1e0
    Dr. What wrote to Zouf <=-

    I have a Kaypro 4/83, Commodore PET, Commodore 64, TRS-80 Model 4P and they all had the same style mechanical keyboards. Even my more modern Tandy 1400LT had one. But my Tandy 1100FD doesn't.

    IBM came out with their PC keyboard with the bucking spring layout, and I'd always thought early Compaqs came out with those mushy membrane keyboards to contrast.


    ... Abandon desire
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    Synchronet realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to multiplemiggs on Wed Apr 7 06:09:00 2021
    @VIA: REALITY
    @MSGID: <606DEE5D.47187.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @REPLY: <606D2574.118423.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    @TZ: c1e0
    multiplemiggs wrote to Zouf <=-

    for Acoustic Couplers and I'm thinking of building one. I would like to make a really compact unit like the one for the TRS-80 102 for my HP-100lx.

    There was a service called pocketmail that used acoustic coupler modems and toll-free numbers to provide mail service. I had a modem for my PalmPilot
    that snapped onto the bottom, and they made a Sharp organizer with a pop-out "neck" that allowed you to connect a phone handset to it. If you could find and cannibalize one of those, they'd make a nice small coupler.




    ... Abandon desire
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    Synchronet realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From multiplemiggs@VERT/BTTMLSS to Dr. What on Wed Apr 7 23:09:00 2021
    @VIA: BTTMLSS
    @MSGID: <606E740B.118444.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    Look on the back of the 102 and you'll see 2 round ports. One is marked "phone". That's the built in 300 BPS modem. They probably made an acoust coupler
    setup that plugs directly into that port.

    I know that they made a modular phone cable that plugged into it.



    That's what I figured they done. The Acoustic Coupler looked like it was
    pretty much a set of cups for the earphone and microphone with a set of cable between them, and a main cable the went back to the 102.

    Have you seen the Youtube video where Fozztexx call his BBS with a Tandy 102 and a Acoustic coupler?



    **** PET ****

    Yeah that chicklet keyboard was a nightmare for touch typists and Commodore took a lot of heat over it. There were even a few aftermarket full keyboards made shortly after the 2001 was released. Back at that time there were few
    word processors that would actually run on the 8K PET Wordpro 1 was about the only one that was usable on a professional level. Also Commodore was late to the game coming up with a printer.
    So I imagine the main interest in the full keyboards were programmers.

    At the time I guess it was acceptable considering they were aiming at the
    home computer market and they were testing the waters.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From multiplemiggs@VERT/BTTMLSS to poindexter FORTRAN on Wed Apr 7 23:18:00 2021
    @VIA: BTTMLSS
    @MSGID: <606E76A9.118445.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    There was a service called pocketmail that used acoustic coupler modems an toll-free numbers to provide mail service. I had a modem for my PalmPilot that snapped onto the bottom, and they made a Sharp organizer with a pop-o "neck" that allowed you to connect a phone handset to it. If you could fin and cannibalize one of those, they'd make a nice small coupler.



    I never knew about the Sharp or Pocketmail. I'll have to look in to those and see what the coupler looked like.

    At this time I was thinking on making a belt case for the HP-100 lx and had
    the acoustic coupler built into it, but I'm always looking for new ways to further compact the idea.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Dr. What on Thu Apr 8 01:07:15 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <606E4933.25625.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <606C68E2.51780.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Dr. What to Zouf on Tue Apr 06 2021 09:18 am

    Zouf wrote to Dr. What <=-

    I have no experience or idea how to program so I don't have much of a concept of space in regards to vintage computers, 24K sounds meagre but I guess it must have been enough for most users back then.

    In that era, the norm was 16K. Smaller systems had only 8K.
    "Beefy" PCs had 32K. But that would quickly increase to 64K and 128K and finally to 640K - which was enough for anyone (according to Bill Gates).

    The keyboards on older systems seem to feel more tactile and solid than the standard (non-mechanical) keyboards in the present day. Perhaps they just have a better build quality.

    That's just the way they built keyboard back then. There really wasn't
    any other technology.

    I have a Kaypro 4/83, Commodore PET, Commodore 64, TRS-80 Model 4P and they all had the same style mechanical keyboards. Even my more modern Tandy 1400LT had one. But my Tandy 1100FD doesn't.

    But the main issue with the older keyboard was layout. Some of the layouts were strange - especially the Commodore PET keyboard.


    ... Proofread carefully to see if you any words out!




    Yes, I do recall Bill Gates' famous phrase. It didn't age too well, lol.

    You have a great vintage computer collection, I especially like the PET and P4. The Model 8032 PETs appear to have a nice keyboard. The other one, the one with the built in cassete player, has a dodgy looking keyboard which could be difficult to type on.

    Is your old hardware still in use?

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to multiplemiggs on Thu Apr 8 01:38:12 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <606E5074.25627.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <606D2574.118423.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: multiplemiggs to Zouf on Tue Apr 06 2021 11:22 pm

    On 05 Apr 2021, Zouf said the following...

    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: multiplemiggs to Zouf on Sun Apr 04 2021 04:34 pm

    Yeah, it was a pretty neat system in its time with a built in termin the probably the most compact acoustic coupler ever made.


    Those acoustic couplers are mind boggling. I only discovered them sever months ago when I saw a video on YouTube of a guy dialling into a BBS w acoustic couplers on a Commodore PET. I didn't know it was a viable met getting on the internet!

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and P

    They are surprising how well they work. I found a few schematics online for Acoustic Couplers and I'm thinking of building one. I would like to make a really compact unit like the one for the TRS-80 102 for my HP-100lx.
    I have a PCMCIA card modem for it, but they pretty much wipe out a set of AA batteries in a few minutes, and the other disadvantage is that I would need actual phone line to plug into. With an Acoustic Coupler I can connect to a pay phone if I wanted to. And if it has it's own power source I can still keep my battery life on the palmtop.

    I don't know but I think that the TRS-80 102 had some of the acoustic couple hardware built into the computer.
    Does yours have a another port outside of a regular RS-232?

    There is a few IC chips that were pretty much a modem on a chip, and there's one that runs at 300 baud which would be prefect for a acoustic coupler.


    Using an acoustic coupler would be quite an experience. I don't have an old style telephone but I probably would acquire one just for the chance to give it a go. I think acoustic couplers are pretty rare, working ones are not something I come across very often.

    My Model 102 has a phone (300 baud) port in addition to the RS-232 serial port.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Vk3jed on Thu Apr 8 01:45:38 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <606E5232.25628.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <606D83E4.26272.dove-general@freeway.apana.org.au>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Vk3jed to Zouf on Wed Apr 07 2021 07:04 pm

    Haha what baud rate are you using?

    I am currently on 300 baud. I heard on Reddit that the TRS-80 Model 100/102 is capable of a maximum rate of 600 baud due to t type of LCD screen it has.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Apr 8 02:06:32 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <606E5718.25630.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <606DAD52.47179.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Zouf on Tue Apr 06 2021 06:57 am

    300 baud was always considered to be about the speed you read at - so you could read along well at 300 baud.

    I used to use 300 baud (and 110 baud) on paper teletypes used with old phone systems, and I can attest to that. It was a comfortable speed to read along without falling behind.

    Because the Model 100/102 use an LCD displaying 40x8 characters, 300 baud is appropriate for this system. The lack of real estate would make faster connections more difficult to use as the machine only has enough RAM to remember 2 screens worth of text.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Apr 8 08:10:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <606EF9EC.51831.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <606DEE5D.47186.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @TZ: c12c
    poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Dr. What <=-

    IBM came out with their PC keyboard with the bucking spring layout, and I'd always thought early Compaqs came out with those mushy membrane keyboards to contrast.

    I don't know if it was a situation where they realized that people were buying their favorite 3rd party keyboard, so there was no point in producing a good one. Or if they just didn't care.

    Like I said, my Tandy 1100FD didn't have the nice mechanical keyboard that
    my other ones do, but it's still really nice to type on. Even compared to
    my modern laptop here.


    ... I need a drink...where's the SPACE BAR?
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to multiplemiggs on Thu Apr 8 08:16:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <606EF9EC.51832.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <606E740B.118444.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    @TZ: c12c
    multiplemiggs wrote to Dr. What <=-

    Have you seen the Youtube video where Fozztexx call his BBS with a
    Tandy 102 and a Acoustic coupler?

    No. But like punch cards, that's a technology that I "missed" (but I really think that's a good thing). 8)

    **** PET ****

    Yeah that chicklet keyboard was a nightmare for touch typists and Commodore took a lot of heat over it. There were even a few aftermarket full keyboards made shortly after the 2001 was released. Back at that
    time there were few word processors that would actually run on the 8K
    PET Wordpro 1 was about the only one that was usable on a professional level. Also Commodore was late to the game coming up with a printer.
    So I imagine the main interest in the full keyboards were programmers.

    I remember that time and I remember several people saying that they needed
    a real keyboard for their PET - and they weren't programmers.

    I remember one guy who was a tech wiz showing off his external keyboard replacement for the PET with the calculator keyboard.

    At the time I guess it was acceptable considering they were aiming at
    the home computer market and they were testing the waters.

    Actually, none of the "big 3" had any idea that their products would take off as they did. Radio Shack, for example, made the first run of their TRS-80s only as large as the number of stores. So if the product flopped, they could repurpose them to manage inventory in the store.

    In Commodore's case, Commodore was already manufacturing calculators. So
    going cheap and repurposing a calculator keyboard (or 2) for their computer seemed like a good way keep costs down in case of product flop.


    ... You can close your eyes to reality but not to memories.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to Zouf on Thu Apr 8 08:21:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <606EF9EC.51833.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <606E4933.25625.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c12c
    Zouf wrote to Dr. What <=-

    Yes, I do recall Bill Gates' famous phrase. It didn't age too well,
    lol.

    No, it didn't. But I do remember getting a RAM upgrade for my Sperry HT
    (IBM XT clone) to bump the RAM from 256K to 640K - just so I could play NetHack. And I didn't feel the need to have more until later.

    Years later, I had a company build a PC to my specs. The motherboard
    that they chose could hold 256MB of RAM. I would have had to choose between
    RAM and a car at that time.

    Is your old hardware still in use?

    For the most part. I don't have a lot of space, so I rotate them in and
    out on the table. I just finished my Kaypro projects, so that's packed
    up right now. The Tandy 1400LT is on the desk where I'm rediscovering
    Turbo Pascal.


    ... Debrief: Wife listening while you talk in your sleep.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to Zouf on Thu Apr 8 08:31:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <606EF9EC.51835.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <606E5232.25628.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c12c
    Zouf wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I am currently on 300 baud. I heard on Reddit that the TRS-80 Model 100/102 is capable of a maximum rate of 600 baud due to t type of LCD screen it has.

    You can get higher rates. But you need to run terminal software that does hardware flow control. Basically tell the other end to stop sending for a moment so that 102 can update the screen.

    The terminal program that comes with the 102 doesn't do hardware flow control.


    ... if you want someone to keep a secret, keep it yourself.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Ogg@VERT/CAPCITY2 to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Apr 8 19:58:00 2021
    @VIA: CAPCITY2
    @MSGID: <606F98B7.53929.dove-gen@capitolcityonline.net>
    @REPLY: <606DAD52.47178.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @TZ: ff10
    Hello poindexter FORTRAN!

    ** On Tuesday 06.04.21 - 06:56, poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Ogg:

    I have typewriters out on display as decor in my shop.
    Young kids are totally amazed at watching the mechanics
    and all the moving parts.

    A local book store had an old manual typewriter (the same
    one I used in High School) and a deck of brown paper 5x7
    cards. Kids were encouraged to type haikus (or any poem) on
    the cards and post them.

    That sounds like a good way to leave one's mark.

    I don't have enough space to dedicate a space for that kind of
    play, but I wish I did. This ongoing covidness is not helping
    to even plan for such an eventuality.

    I *do* have a small play area with some toys kids can pull out
    of a couple of baskets, and a short table/display that has a
    chalkboard. Some kids are encouraged to leave praises. Just
    google "bancroft books" and look for "See photos" for one of
    them.


    The kids were enthralled with the workings of a typewriter.

    Modern electronic devices have taken out the "discovery" aspect
    of how things work.


    --- OpenXP 5.0.49
    * Origin: Ogg's Dovenet Point (723:320/1.9)
    Synchronet CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From multiplemiggs@VERT/BTTMLSS to Dr. What on Thu Apr 8 23:10:00 2021
    @VIA: BTTMLSS
    @MSGID: <606FC5AE.118483.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    I remember that time and I remember several people saying that they needed a real keyboard for their PET - and they weren't programmers.

    I remember one guy who was a tech wiz showing off his external keyboard replacement for the PET with the calculator keyboard.

    Actually, none of the "big 3" had any idea that their products would take as they did. Radio Shack, for example, made the first run of their TRS-80 only as large as the number of stores. So if the product flopped, they co repurpose them to manage inventory in the store.

    In Commodore's case, Commodore was already manufacturing calculators. So going cheap and repurposing a calculator keyboard (or 2) for their compute seemed like a good way keep costs down in case of product flop.


    At the time everyone would have been transitioning from full keyboards also which would have made it more of a challenge too. Now most of us have used smaller keyboards on cell phones and such. The early home computing days were such a test of the waters. It's an interesting time. Commodore was swamped
    with orders and really when it came down to it, BASIC Version 1 was released full of bugs, especially the very first ROMS with the different screen edit. The early Sanyo white key cassette drives were pretty buggy as well.

    The Steel cabinets on the early pets were made at Commodore's file
    cabinet plant. They were spot welded together and then the seams were filled with bronze and hand finished. Quite a impressive about of metalwork considering they were in production past being a prototype.

    I didn't know about Tandy only doing such a limited number of computers. that was a smart move on their part.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Dr. What on Fri Apr 9 00:41:40 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <606F94B4.25658.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <606EF9EC.51833.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Dr. What to Zouf on Thu Apr 08 2021 08:21 am

    Years later, I had a company build a PC to my specs. The motherboard
    that they chose could hold 256MB of RAM. I would have had to choose between RAM and a car at that time.

    Is your old hardware still in use?

    For the most part. I don't have a lot of space, so I rotate them in and
    out on the table. I just finished my Kaypro projects, so that's packed
    up right now. The Tandy 1400LT is on the desk where I'm rediscovering
    Turbo Pascal.


    When I properly started playing games on computers, the 32mb RAM requirement was quite common. I think this was in the late 90's.

    The Tandy 1400 LT is adorable, I really like the design. Running MS-DOS is a huge advantage also due to the sheer armount of software available for it.

    Apple and Compaq came out with very similar looking laptop designs.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Dr. What on Fri Apr 9 00:52:13 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <606F972D.25660.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <606EF9EC.51835.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Dr. What to Zouf on Thu Apr 08 2021 08:31 am

    You can get higher rates. But you need to run terminal software that does hardware flow control. Basically tell the other end to stop sending for a moment so that 102 can update the screen.

    The terminal program that comes with the 102 doesn't do hardware flow contro


    Interesting, thanks! I mean, I do enjoy reading messages and posting on this thing but due to the atypical screen I don't think it's going to be in long-term use for me. It's just a great little computer to add to my collection. The only thing I have to do now is remove the CMOS battery from the board because I don't know how long it has been in there and I don't want it leaking acid while the computer is in storage!

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Zouf on Fri Apr 9 19:40:00 2021
    @VIA: FREEWAY
    @MSGID: <60702CE0.26341.dove-general@freeway.apana.org.au>
    @REPLY: <606E5232.25628.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: 1258
    On 04-08-21 01:45, Zouf wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    @VIA: VERT/AMSTRAD
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Vk3jed to Zouf on Wed Apr 07 2021 07:04 pm

    Haha what baud rate are you using?

    I am currently on 300 baud. I heard on Reddit that the TRS-80 Model 100/102 is capable of a maximum rate of 600 baud due to t type of LCD screen it has.

    Ouch! That's tough to get used to these days! 300 baud was bad enough in the early 90s. :P


    ... A life? Where can I download that?
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
    Synchronet Freeway BBS, Bendigo Australia. freeway.apana.org.au
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to Zouf on Fri Apr 9 08:14:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <607053A6.51870.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <606F94B4.25658.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c12c
    Zouf wrote to Dr. What <=-

    The Tandy 1400 LT is adorable, I really like the design. Running MS-DOS
    is a huge advantage also due to the sheer armount of software available for it.

    The keyboard is really nice and it's fairly fast.

    But the screen limits the software available. Software will *think* it's
    CGA, but some color combinations will simply be unreadable.

    It did some with some utilities that would let you reverse the LCD and
    change the color pallet, so sometimes you can get the software to be
    usable.

    Then there's the 720K limitation. No hard drive. So everything has to run
    off a 720K diskette. Most of the software on the Internet is made for EGA/VGA systems with hard drives.

    Later 1400 models (like the HD with hard drive, or the FD with dual floppies, but could get a hard drive) took care of that.

    Supposedly the LT can get a hard drive too, but I'm still trying to make that work.

    Apple and Compaq came out with very similar looking laptop designs.

    Check out the Tandy 200 and 600. It seems that the "clamshell" style of laptop was just natural.


    ... Jesus saves....Passes to Moses....He shoots! HE SCORES!
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to Zouf on Fri Apr 9 08:15:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <607053A6.51871.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <606F972D.25660.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c12c
    Zouf wrote to Dr. What <=-

    Interesting, thanks! I mean, I do enjoy reading messages and posting on this thing but due to the atypical screen I don't think it's going to
    be in long-term use for me. It's just a great little computer to add to
    my collection. The only thing I have to do now is remove the CMOS
    battery from the board because I don't know how long it has been in
    there and I don't want it leaking acid while the computer is in
    storage!

    Today, the 102 is great for taking notes in a meeting. You can build a
    modern version of the Tandy Portable Disk Drive and copy the notes to a
    SD card that can be read in modern computers.


    ... If I want your opinion I'll beat it out of you!
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Dr. What on Thu Apr 8 15:27:00 2021
    @VIA: REALITY
    @MSGID: <607075E8.47247.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @REPLY: <606EF9EC.51831.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: c1e0
    Dr. What wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    I don't know if it was a situation where they realized that people were buying their favorite 3rd party keyboard, so there was no point in producing a good one. Or if they just didn't care.

    I remember going to a white-box store and having them build a computer for
    me - they custom tailored the memory, motherboard, video card, hard disk,
    and when it came to the keyboard, gave my my choice of soft or "kricky".

    The Focus 2001 keyboard - was my favorite keyboard for the better part of
    the 1980s and 1990s.



    ... Abandon desire
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    Synchronet realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Ogg on Fri Apr 9 08:33:00 2021
    @VIA: REALITY
    @MSGID: <607075E8.47253.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @REPLY: <606F98B7.53929.dove-gen@capitolcityonline.net>
    @TZ: c1e0
    Ogg wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    Modern electronic devices have taken out the "discovery" aspect
    of how things work.

    Funny, one of my favorite books growing up was called "The Way Things Work". One side of the page was a description of a modern item and the other was a wonderful illustration of the inner workings. Everything from rocket engines to retractable ballpoint pens and everything in between.

    In fact.I just ordered it. The Way Things Work, by C. Van Amerongen.
    ... Abandon normal instruments
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    Synchronet realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to multiplemiggs on Fri Apr 9 08:37:00 2021
    @VIA: REALITY
    @MSGID: <607075E8.47254.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @REPLY: <606FC5AE.118483.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    @TZ: c1e0
    multiplemiggs wrote to Dr. What <=-

    At the time everyone would have been transitioning from full keyboards also which would have made it more of a challenge too. Now most of us
    have used smaller keyboards on cell phones and such. The early home computing days were such a test of the waters. It's an interesting
    time. Commodore was swamped with orders and really when it came down to it, BASIC Version 1 was released full of bugs, especially the very
    first ROMS with the different screen edit. The early Sanyo white key cassette drives were pretty buggy as well.

    I did my first computer class on CBM 4032s, and there were shops that made custom ROMs that we used. I suppose they left memory addresses free?

    POKE to a memory address and you could do hi-res graphics, or some other add-on features, of which memory fades. I do remember doing algebraic
    graphing using the add-on ROM.

    Skyles Electric Works, that was the company.


    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    Synchronet realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From Ogg@VERT/CAPCITY2 to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Apr 9 19:25:00 2021
    @VIA: CAPCITY2
    @MSGID: <6070E284.53983.dove-gen@capitolcityonline.net>
    @REPLY: <607075E8.47253.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @TZ: ff10
    Hello poindexter FORTRAN!

    ** On Friday 09.04.21 - 08:33, poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Ogg:

    Ogg wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    Modern electronic devices have taken out the "discovery"
    aspect of how things work.

    Funny, one of my favorite books growing up was called "The
    Way Things Work". One side of the page was a description of
    a modern item and the other was a wonderful illustration of
    the inner workings. Everything from rocket engines to
    retractable ballpoint pens and everything in between.

    I remember a enjoying a book by that name many years ago too!

    In fact.I just ordered it. The Way Things Work, by C. Van
    Amerongen.

    The originals are nolonger in print. But the co-author,
    Macaulay, has a series of books that cover modern things:

    Built to Last,
    The Way We Work,
    Building Big,
    The Way Things Work Now.


    --- OpenXP 5.0.49
    * Origin: Ogg's Dovenet Point (723:320/1.9)
    Synchronet CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From multiplemiggs@VERT/BTTMLSS to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat Apr 10 01:12:00 2021
    @VIA: BTTMLSS
    @MSGID: <607133E1.118538.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    I did my first computer class on CBM 4032s, and there were shops that made custom ROMs that we used. I suppose they left memory addresses free?

    POKE to a memory address and you could do hi-res graphics, or some other add-on features, of which memory fades. I do remember doing algebraic graphing using the add-on ROM.

    Skyles Electric Works, that was the company.


    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    Synchronet realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org

    Yep. There are 2 or perhaps 3 open ROM sockets on my 4016 and you can SYS to that location to access them. The one that's in mine is the Toolkit ROM that does some extra BASIC commands. I forget right off hand what the location is, but it's above the screen memory location of 33768 if I recall.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat Apr 10 10:20:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <6071B6A3.51921.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <607075E8.47253.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @TZ: c12c
    poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Ogg <=-

    Funny, one of my favorite books growing up was called "The Way Things Work". One side of the page was a description of a modern item and the other was a wonderful illustration of the inner workings. Everything
    from rocket engines to retractable ballpoint pens and everything in between.

    Randall Monroe (XKCD comic) has some books like that.

    "Thing explainer" which explains everything in **very** simple terms (to the point that it's funny and educational).

    "What If" Serious answers to absurd hypothetical questions.
    And the opposite
    "How to" absurd scientific advice for common real-world problems.

    And then there's "Ignition!" by John D. Clark - An informal history of liquid rocket propellents. You don't need to know chemistry for it to be a good
    read (but it helps). Sort of like my dad (Jr. High science teacher) - he taught me many things - most of which he warned me *not* to do and why.


    ... When a girl goes bad--men go right after her.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Vk3jed on Sun Apr 11 22:57:52 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <607370E0.25751.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <60702CE0.26341.dove-general@freeway.apana.org.au>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Vk3jed to Zouf on Fri Apr 09 2021 07:40 pm

    Ouch! That's tough to get used to these days! 300 baud was bad enough in t early 90s. :P


    It does take a while to load a message but with the 40x8 character screen it's not to bad as I can read everything as it's being displayed. Like I said, I don't think I'll be able to use this computer long-term due to it being totally barebones and featureless. I'll probably keep using it for the next week or so before removing the C
    internal battery and placing it into storage.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Dr. What on Sun Apr 11 23:15:15 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <607374F3.25752.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <607053A6.51870.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Dr. What to Zouf on Fri Apr 09 2021 08:14 am

    Zouf wrote to Dr. What <=-

    The Tandy 1400 LT is adorable, I really like the design. Running MS-DOS is a huge advantage also due to the sheer armount of software available for it.

    The keyboard is really nice and it's fairly fast.

    But the screen limits the software available. Software will *think* it's CGA, but some color combinations will simply be unreadable.

    It did some with some utilities that would let you reverse the LCD and change the color pallet, so sometimes you can get the software to be
    usable.

    Then there's the 720K limitation. No hard drive. So everything has to run off a 720K diskette. Most of the software on the Internet is made for EGA/V systems with hard drives.

    Later 1400 models (like the HD with hard drive, or the FD with dual floppies but could get a hard drive) took care of that.

    Supposedly the LT can get a hard drive too, but I'm still trying to make tha work.

    Apple and Compaq came out with very similar looking laptop designs.

    Check out the Tandy 200 and 600. It seems that the "clamshell" style of lap was just natural.


    ... Jesus saves....Passes to Moses....He shoots! HE SCORES!

    It's a shame that it's not the most accessible machine out there. I take it that there's no SCSI connector for an external HDD? I've seen LGR, the YouTuber, play games on late 80's laptops with similar screen dimensions. Seeing Sim City on something like that is pretty impressive, but probably unplayable.

    I don't think I'd be able to distinguish between clamshell offerings from different companies, they all seem to look the same to me. I do really find the chunky industrial design applealing though. Obviously the natural progression from luggables.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Dr. What on Sun Apr 11 23:23:53 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <607376F9.25753.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <607053A6.51871.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Dr. What to Zouf on Fri Apr 09 2021 08:15 am

    Zouf wrote to Dr. What <=-

    Interesting, thanks! I mean, I do enjoy reading messages and posting on this thing but due to the atypical screen I don't think it's going to be in long-term use for me. It's just a great little computer to add to my collection. The only thing I have to do now is remove the CMOS battery from the board because I don't know how long it has been in there and I don't want it leaking acid while the computer is in storage!

    Today, the 102 is great for taking notes in a meeting. You can build a modern version of the Tandy Portable Disk Drive and copy the notes to a
    SD card that can be read in modern computers.


    ... If I want your opinion I'll beat it out of you!

    I can imagine the 102 being great in a business or academic enviroment. The keyboard feels like one from a proper desktop and s far superior and comfortable to type on than modern laptops. I'd really like to see an up-to-date refresh with the same design philosophy.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to Zouf on Mon Apr 12 08:42:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <607443DF.51947.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <607374F3.25752.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c12c
    Zouf wrote to Dr. What <=-

    It's a shame that it's not the most accessible machine out there. I
    take it that there's no SCSI connector for an external HDD?

    SCSI was years away when that computer came out.

    The Tandy 102 has a TPDD (Tandy Portable Disk Drive) that used floppy disks. Using that jumping off point, software was created to emulate that TPDD
    on modern hardware. Several of us have created little RasPi0-based disk
    drives for our 100/102/200 systems.

    I don't think I'd be able to distinguish between clamshell offerings
    from different companies, they all seem to look the same to me. I do really find the chunky industrial design applealing though. Obviously
    the natural progression from luggables.

    They tried to get as much into as small a package as possible (while staying price competitive).

    Remember that LCD displays have only ever been made by a handful of companies so given a time frame, the "normal" screen size will pretty much all be the same. Also, color was always more expensive than monochrome, so even if the color LCDs were available, they probably weren't in general use.

    This reminds me of a car museum near me. If you go there, you see many
    of the high end classic cars, but very few of the 'workhorse' cars. Did
    you ever wonder why? Because the people who could afford the high end
    classic cars could also afford to maintain and keep them in good repair.
    The 'workhorse' cars tended to just be worked until junk.

    The same goes for computers. Many of the old workhorse type of computers
    got pretty much worn out from use.


    ... We are born crying, live complaining, die disappointed
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Zouf on Mon Apr 12 06:45:00 2021
    @VIA: REALITY
    @MSGID: <6074566A.47324.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @REPLY: <607376F9.25753.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c1e0
    Zouf wrote to Dr. What <=-

    I can imagine the 102 being great in a business or academic enviroment. The keyboard feels like one from a proper desktop and s far superior
    and comfortable to type on than modern laptops. I'd really like to see
    an up-to-date refresh with the same design philosophy.

    I've seen a 3D printed case for a Raspberry Pi that included a keypad-less mechanical keyboard in roughly the same proportions as the Model 100/102.
    Not sure about the screen, think it was a small 4:3 LCD.


    ... Abandon desire
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    Synchronet realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Apr 13 07:45:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <60758677.51959.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <6074566A.47324.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @TZ: c12c
    poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Zouf <=-

    I've seen a 3D printed case for a Raspberry Pi that included a
    keypad-less mechanical keyboard in roughly the same proportions as the Model 100/102. Not sure about the screen, think it was a small 4:3 LCD.

    I've seen more than a few attempts at building a "modern Tandy 102". All looked nice, but didn't really work well for normal use.


    ... I'm easy to please as long as I get my way.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Zouf on Wed Apr 14 18:01:00 2021
    @VIA: FREEWAY
    @MSGID: <6076C510.26445.dove-general@freeway.apana.org.au>
    @REPLY: <607370E0.25751.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: 1258
    On 04-11-21 22:57, Zouf wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    @VIA: VERT/AMSTRAD
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Vk3jed to Zouf on Fri Apr 09 2021 07:40 pm

    Ouch! That's tough to get used to these days! 300 baud was bad enough in t early 90s. :P


    It does take a while to load a message but with the 40x8 character
    screen it's not to bad as I can read everything as it's being
    displayed. Like I said, I don't think I'll be able to use this computer long-term due to it being totally barebones and featureless. I'll
    probably keep using it for the next week or so before removing the C internal battery and placing it into storage.

    Painful for me, as I can skim at _much_ higher rates than a 300 baud connection can provide. :)


    ... Mental compatability not covered by warranty.
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
    Synchronet Freeway BBS, Bendigo Australia. freeway.apana.org.au
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Dr. What on Wed Apr 14 09:45:27 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <6076ABA7.25782.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <607443DF.51947.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Dr. What to Zouf on Mon Apr 12 2021 08:42 am

    They tried to get as much into as small a package as possible (while staying price competitive).

    Remember that LCD displays have only ever been made by a handful of companie so given a time frame, the "normal" screen size will pretty much all be the same. Also, color was always more expensive than monochrome, so even if the color LCDs were available, they probably weren't in general use.

    This reminds me of a car museum near me. If you go there, you see many
    of the high end classic cars, but very few of the 'workhorse' cars. Did
    you ever wonder why? Because the people who could afford the high end classic cars could also afford to maintain and keep them in good repair.
    The 'workhorse' cars tended to just be worked until junk.

    The same goes for computers. Many of the old workhorse type of computers got pretty much worn out from use.


    Those older looking laptops are really something to behold, I would be tempted into adding an old Toshiba SLT 286 or Zenith Turbosport 386 to my collection. I was watching an old '89 episode of Computer Chronicles called 'Laptops' featuring a lot of desirable and collectable high-end machines. I was quite taken by the NEC UltraLite which was produced in '88... to me it's the first laptop I've ever observed with a modern form factor. It's almost indistinguishable from any generic laptop that was released a decade later.

    I agree. It's quite hard to find workhorse type computers used in businesses in good repair. Even something highly popular such as an IBM 5150 or 5160 is near impossible to get a hold of despite millions being produced, only the more exotic computers appear to have survived in great numbers. I do my best to preserve my own computers into posterity despite lacking any real computer knowledge. My dad is a retired electronic engineer so he's able to recap or reflow boards, remove/replace internal batteries and re-wire if necesary. The best I can do is clean them up and make sure these machines don't die on my watch so that they can be passed onto the next generation.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to poindexter FORTRAN on Wed Apr 14 09:54:55 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <6076ADDF.25783.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <6074566A.47324.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Zouf on Mon Apr 12 2021 06:45 am

    I've seen a 3D printed case for a Raspberry Pi that included a keypad-less mechanical keyboard in roughly the same proportions as the Model 100/102. Not sure about the screen, think it was a small 4:3 LCD.

    I've also seen a Raspberry Pi placed into a hollowed out (and presumably dead) Model 102. It looked really great with a full colour LCD screen.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to Zouf on Wed Apr 14 08:15:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <6076E34E.51974.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <6076ABA7.25782.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c12c
    Zouf wrote to Dr. What <=-

    I agree. It's quite hard to find workhorse type computers used in businesses in good repair. Even something highly popular such as an IBM 5150 or 5160 is near impossible to get a hold of despite millions being produced, only the more exotic computers appear to have survived in
    great numbers.

    Yup. Just like cars. After several years, they are "old" and "useless".
    So they are thrown away. It's only many years after that they become
    "classic" and deemed worthy of preservation.

    I do my best to preserve my own computers into posterity
    despite lacking any real computer knowledge. My dad is a retired electronic engineer so he's able to recap or reflow boards,
    remove/replace internal batteries and re-wire if necesary. The best I
    can do is clean them up and make sure these machines don't die on my
    watch so that they can be passed onto the next generation.

    I originally got into the vintage computer hobby because I started to learn
    how to work with electronics. My education and work was always on the software side of things. So I wanted to expand and learn some about the hardware
    side.

    I always suggest to people that they learn basic soldering and electronics
    if they want to keep old computers.

    Like vintage cars, you just can't take them to the local repair place to
    get them fixed. You need to be able to do some of the maintenance yourself.


    ... You can never get rid of a bad temper by losing it.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to Zouf on Wed Apr 14 08:35:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <6076E34E.51975.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <6076ADDF.25783.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c12c
    Zouf wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    I've also seen a Raspberry Pi placed into a hollowed out (and
    presumably dead) Model 102. It looked really great with a full colour
    LCD screen.

    The hard part of those kinds of projects is the keyboard interface. But
    I have seen things that are making that easier and easier.

    The next hardest part is fitting the new technology into the case.


    ... The earth is 98% full. Please delete anyone you can.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Dr. What on Wed Apr 14 07:09:00 2021
    @VIA: REALITY
    @MSGID: <6076FA4A.47354.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @REPLY: <6076E34E.51974.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: c1e0
    Dr. What wrote to Zouf <=-

    I agree. It's quite hard to find workhorse type computers used in businesses in good repair. Even something highly popular such as an IBM 5150 or 5160 is near impossible to get a hold of despite millions being produced, only the more exotic computers appear to have survived in
    great numbers.

    Yup. Just like cars. After several years, they are "old" and
    "useless". So they are thrown away. It's only many years after that
    they become "classic" and deemed worthy of preservation.

    I came into a job a couple of years ago, and the CIO told me that he tried
    to have my team clean things up before I got there. He said, with an air of disgust that we still had PS2s and IBM ATs laying around and had disposed of "pallets" of them to get things in shape before I arrived.

    I went home and wept.



    ... ZIMA TASTES BETTER WHEN IT'S ILLEGAL
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    Synchronet realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Vk3jed on Thu Apr 15 11:48:07 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <607819E7.25798.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <6076C510.26445.dove-general@freeway.apana.org.au>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Vk3jed to Zouf on Wed Apr 14 2021 06:01 pm

    Painful for me, as I can skim at _much_ higher rates than a 300 baud connect can provide. :)

    It must have been frustrating for you if you were ever tied down to 300 baud. I cannot speed read so it's perfect for me. I think most of the general population can only comfortably read at that speed.

    I've picked up a bit of an interest on teletype machines and have seen numerous people on Reddit connect them to Bulletin Boards as terminals. Most type at around 110 bits per second! They were used quite frequently in the 1970s so I guess most of us weren't around using these things back then. At least you'll end up with a hard copy of everything that you do :-).

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Dr. What on Thu Apr 15 12:05:48 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <60781E0C.25799.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <6076E34E.51974.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Dr. What to Zouf on Wed Apr 14 2021 08:15 am

    I originally got into the vintage computer hobby because I started to learn how to work with electronics. My education and work was always on the softw side of things. So I wanted to expand and learn some about the hardware side.

    I always suggest to people that they learn basic soldering and electronics if they want to keep old computers.

    Like vintage cars, you just can't take them to the local repair place to
    get them fixed. You need to be able to do some of the maintenance yourself.

    It's great that you've learned how to maintain vintage machines through your own volition. I still haven't much of an idea regarding the electronics side... my dad is great at diagnosing problems on boards and repairing them which is probably why I never felt the need to learn for myself. I stick to simpler things purely to do with cosmetics such as cleaning and retr0briting cases. My techincal ability is so low that it's mydad who takes floppy drives apart to grease them up. I am thinking of purcasing a parts/repair IBM system this winter as a project and work on it with him to learn the basics. He has over 35 years of electronics under his sleeve so I'll never hold a candle to him, but I would like to learn how to do simpler things such as replace capacitors and internal batteries, i.e. basic soldering.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Dr. What on Thu Apr 15 12:10:51 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <60781F3B.25800.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <6076E34E.51975.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Dr. What to Zouf on Wed Apr 14 2021 08:35 am

    The hard part of those kinds of projects is the keyboard interface. But
    I have seen things that are making that easier and easier.

    The next hardest part is fitting the new technology into the case.

    Yes, I think they are known as Arduino board

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Apr 15 08:07:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <60782FE2.51991.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <6076FA4A.47354.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @TZ: c12c
    poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Dr. What <=-

    I came into a job a couple of years ago, and the CIO told me that he
    tried to have my team clean things up before I got there. He said, with
    an air of disgust that we still had PS2s and IBM ATs laying around and
    had disposed of "pallets" of them to get things in shape before I
    arrived.

    You could have pointed him to eBay and showed him what those computers were going for.

    He probably would have went home and wept.
    8)


    ... You go to heaven...God sneezes... What do you say?
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to Zouf on Thu Apr 15 08:08:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <60782FE2.51992.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <60781E0C.25799.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c12c
    Zouf wrote to Dr. What <=-

    him, but I would like to learn how to do simpler things such as replace capacitors and internal batteries, i.e. basic soldering.

    That's where everyone starts. As you get more experience, the "harder" things become less hard.


    ... Give a man an inch, and he thinks he's a ruler.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to Zouf on Thu Apr 15 08:10:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <60782FE2.51993.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <60781F3B.25800.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c12c
    Zouf wrote to Dr. What <=-

    The next hardest part is fitting the new technology into the case.

    Yes, I think they are known as Arduino board

    There are many Arduino-like microcontrollers that will work. But every
    vintage keyboard is different and debugging a microcontroller is a bigger hassle than debugging your software on a computer.


    ... You go to heaven...God sneezes... What do you say?
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Apr 15 12:20:26 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <6078217A.25803.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <6076FA4A.47354.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Dr. What on Wed Apr 14 2021 07:09 am


    I came into a job a couple of years ago, and the CIO told me that he tried to have my team clean things up before I got there. He said, with an air of disgust that we still had PS2s and IBM ATs laying around and had disposed of "pallets" of them to get things in shape before I arrived.

    I went home and wept.

    It's so sad that he thought he was trying to do you a favour ;-(

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Ogg@VERT/CAPCITY2 to Zouf on Thu Apr 15 09:15:00 2021
    @VIA: CAPCITY2
    @MSGID: <60783CFB.54081.dove-gen@capitolcityonline.net>
    @REPLY: <607819E7.25798.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: ff10
    Hello Zouf!

    ** On Thursday 15.04.21 - 11:48, Zouf wrote to Vk3jed:

    I've picked up a bit of an interest on teletype machines and have seen numerous people on Reddit connect them to Bulletin Boards as terminals.
    [snip]

    then. At least you'll end up with a hard copy of everything that you do :-).

    ..and the constant noise! No thanks.


    --- OpenXP 5.0.49
    * Origin: Ogg's Dovenet Point (723:320/1.9)
    Synchronet CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Knightbbs@VERT/ENSEMBLE to Ogg on Thu Apr 15 13:36:51 2021
    @VIA: ENSEMBLE
    @MSGID: <607887C3.28604.dove-general@warensemble.com>
    @REPLY: <607075E8.47253.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @TZ: c168
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Ogg on Fri Apr 09 2021 08:33 am

    ---
    Synchronet War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.com
  • From multiplemiggs@VERT/BTTMLSS to Zouf on Fri Apr 16 00:01:00 2021
    @VIA: BTTMLSS
    @MSGID: <60790C10.118633.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    would like to learn how to do simpler things such as replace capacitors an internal batteries, i.e. basic soldering.
    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!

    The best way to learn soldering is the get some junk circuit boards and a soldering iron, maybe 40 or 60 watts and start practicing.
    A junk circuit board is a great learning tool as you don't have to worry
    about trashing it, and you can just concentrate on soldering.

    You don't need anything elaborate, just a basic iron and some good 60/40 electronics grade solder. Go for a smaller iron if you want to work with smaller parts.

    That's all I use for my main iron and I've been repairing electronics for 27 years now. Most of the stuff I work on these days is old tube and early transistor equipment.

    Start unsoldering capacitors and resistors and soldering them back in.
    Keep the tip clean, and you'll have better heat transfer to your work.
    Heat your work and feed the solder in right in between your work and the tip
    of your iron.

    Your Dad will be able to give you some hands on pointers as well.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Zouf on Fri Apr 16 19:34:00 2021
    @VIA: FREEWAY
    @MSGID: <60797E0E.26480.dove-general@freeway.apana.org.au>
    @REPLY: <607819E7.25798.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: 1258
    On 04-15-21 11:48, Zouf wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Painful for me, as I can skim at _much_ higher rates than a 300 baud connect can provide. :)

    It must have been frustrating for you if you were ever tied down to 300 baud. I cannot speed read so it's perfect for me. I think most of the general population can only comfortably read at that speed.

    Yeah it was. I do read in unusual ways, from fast but skimming to slow and detailed.

    I've picked up a bit of an interest on teletype machines and have seen numerous people on Reddit connect them to Bulletin Boards as terminals. Most type at around 110 bits per second! They were used quite
    frequently in the 1970s so I guess most of us weren't around using
    these things back then. At least you'll end up with a hard copy of everything that you do :-).

    I have used those at university for logging into mainframes (in the late 80s), definitely an interesting experience! :)


    ... Get too many irons in your fire and you'll put it out.
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
    Synchronet Freeway BBS, Bendigo Australia. freeway.apana.org.au
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Dr. What on Fri Apr 16 13:57:05 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <607989A1.25818.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <60782FE2.51993.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Dr. What to Zouf on Thu Apr 15 2021 08:10 am

    There are many Arduino-like microcontrollers that will work. But every vintage keyboard is different and debugging a microcontroller is a bigger hassle than debugging your software on a computer.

    It sounds complicated, I wouldn't know where to start. I once saw a video of a 1930 Teletype being used as a Linux Terminal. They used some kind of micro controller to translate ASCII into five-bit Baudot code. Impressive to see!

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Ogg on Fri Apr 16 14:02:23 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <60798ADF.25819.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <60783CFB.54081.dove-gen@capitolcityonline.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Ogg to Zouf on Thu Apr 15 2021 09:15 am

    Hello Zouf!

    ** On Thursday 15.04.21 - 11:48, Zouf wrote to Vk3jed:

    I've picked up a bit of an interest on teletype machines and have seen numerous people on Reddit connect them to Bulletin Boards as terminals.
    [snip]

    then. At least you'll end up with a hard copy of everything that you do :-).

    ..and the constant noise! No thanks.


    Haha, yes... my ears would be ringing after the 10 minutes it would take just to log into a BBS. Very impractical by today's standards and I would never dream of getting one due to their sheer size and the skill level required to maintain one. Still a nice little piece of history though.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to multiplemiggs on Fri Apr 16 14:24:41 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <60799019.25822.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <60790C10.118633.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: multiplemiggs to Zouf on Fri Apr 16 2021 12:01 am

    The best way to learn soldering is the get some junk circuit boards and a soldering iron, maybe 40 or 60 watts and start practicing.
    A junk circuit board is a great learning tool as you don't have to worry about trashing it, and you can just concentrate on soldering.

    You don't need anything elaborate, just a basic iron and some good 60/40 electronics grade solder. Go for a smaller iron if you want to work with smaller parts.

    That's all I use for my main iron and I've been repairing electronics for 27 years now. Most of the stuff I work on these days is old tube and early transistor equipment.

    Start unsoldering capacitors and resistors and soldering them back in.
    Keep the tip clean, and you'll have better heat transfer to your work.
    Heat your work and feed the solder in right in between your work and the tip of your iron.

    Your Dad will be able to give you some hands on pointers as well.

    Thanks for the advice, I really apreciate it! I will pick up some junk boards to practice on and have my dad supervise me to begin with.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Dr. What on Sat Apr 17 08:24:29 2021
    @VIA: BBSESINF
    @MSGID: <607AE18D.4400.dove-gen@bbses.info>
    @REPLY: <60782FE2.51991.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: c168
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Dr. What to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Apr 15 2021 08:07 am

    poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Dr. What <=-

    I came into a job a couple of years ago, and the CIO told me that he tried to have my team clean things up before I got there. He said, with an air of disgust that we still had PS2s and IBM ATs laying around and had disposed of "pallets" of them to get things in shape before I arrived.

    You could have pointed him to eBay and showed him what those computers were going for.

    He probably would have went home and wept.
    8)



    if it's taking up space and it's costing a company money. it's better to get rid of that stuff.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From multiplemiggs@VERT/BTTMLSS to Zouf on Sat Apr 17 22:44:00 2021
    @VIA: BTTMLSS
    @MSGID: <607B9D0B.118664.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    Thanks for the advice, I really apreciate it! I will pick up some junk boa to practice on and have my dad supervise me to begin with.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!

    I'm sure you'll do well. Soldering is pretty easy once you get the hang of
    it.

    Another thing to note is when you are soldering a part in is to keep a eye on the the melted solder, and when you see the solder flow across all your work, lift the tip of the iron off your work. And just feed in enough solder wire
    so that the molten solder continues to flow till you have the right amount
    for a good solder joint.
    A good solder joint should look bright, smooth and shiny.
    If it looks like there are jagged edges on it, or it looks crystalline, then you need to apply more heat.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From Ogg@VERT/CAPCITY2 to Zouf on Sat Apr 17 21:16:00 2021
    @VIA: CAPCITY2
    @MSGID: <607B8C7F.54121.dove-gen@capitolcityonline.net>
    @REPLY: <60798ADF.25819.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: ff10
    Hello Zouf!

    ** On Friday 16.04.21 - 14:02, Zouf wrote to Ogg:

    I've picked up a bit of an interest on teletype machines...

    ..and the constant noise! No thanks.


    Haha, yes... my ears would be ringing after the 10 minutes
    it would take just to log into a BBS. Very impractical by
    today's standards and I would never dream of getting one due
    to their sheer size and the skill level required to maintain
    one. Still a nice little piece of history though.

    The dotmatrix printers must have been the next to the worst as
    far as noise was concerned. I really don't miss those machines
    at all.


    --- OpenXP 5.0.49
    * Origin: Ogg's Dovenet Point (723:320/1.9)
    Synchronet CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Ogg on Sun Apr 18 06:33:32 2021
    @VIA: BBSESINF
    @MSGID: <607C190C.4411.dove-gen@bbses.info>
    @REPLY: <607B8C7F.54121.dove-gen@capitolcityonline.net>
    @TZ: c168
    Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Ogg to Zouf on Sat Apr 17 2021 09:16 pm


    The dotmatrix printers must have been the next to the worst as
    far as noise was concerned. I really don't miss those machines
    at all.


    i used to print a manual and then walk down to the corner store to get soda. i could hear my printer half a block away.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to MRO on Sun Apr 18 08:04:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <607C2235.52038.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <607AE18D.4400.dove-gen@bbses.info>
    @TZ: c12c
    MRO wrote to Dr. What <=-

    You could have pointed him to eBay and showed him what those computers were going for.

    He probably would have went home and wept.
    8)

    if it's taking up space and it's costing a company money. it's better
    to get rid of that stuff. ---

    Never said he shouldn't get rid of it. But scraping it brought the company very little money when they could have sold them on eBay for much more.


    ... 74% of all statistics are made up on the spot
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to multiplemiggs on Sun Apr 18 16:44:09 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <607C53C9.25852.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <607B9D0B.118664.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: multiplemiggs to Zouf on Sat Apr 17 2021 10:44 pm

    Thanks for the advice, I really apreciate it! I will pick up some junk to practice on and have my dad supervise me to begin with.

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and P

    I'm sure you'll do well. Soldering is pretty easy once you get the hang of it.

    Another thing to note is when you are soldering a part in is to keep a eye o the the melted solder, and when you see the solder flow across all your work lift the tip of the iron off your work. And just feed in enough solder wire so that the molten solder continues to flow till you have the right amount for a good solder joint.
    A good solder joint should look bright, smooth and shiny.
    If it looks like there are jagged edges on it, or it looks crystalline, then you need to apply more heat.

    That's all note I'm sure I'll make a horrendous mess of a lot of damaged/broken boards before I become competent in any way, shape or form. I sure as hell won't be touching any genuine project machines this year as they'll require a steady hand. Again, I appreciate the advoce!

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to Ogg on Sun Apr 18 16:53:41 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <607C5605.25853.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <607B8C7F.54121.dove-gen@capitolcityonline.net>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Ogg to Zouf on Sat Apr 17 2021 09:16 pm

    The dotmatrix printers must have been the next to the worst as
    far as noise was concerned. I really don't miss those machines
    at all.

    I've never heard any of the older Teletype or punch style printers other than on YouTube videos. When I first started school, the Dot Martix printers were getting phased out in favour of laser printer I still do remember the high pitched ear-splitting noises they made. /s

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Dr. What on Sun Apr 18 18:48:10 2021
    @VIA: BBSESINF
    @MSGID: <607CC53A.4419.dove-gen@bbses.info>
    @REPLY: <607C2235.52038.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: c168
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Dr. What to MRO on Sun Apr 18 2021 08:04 am

    if it's taking up space and it's costing a company money. it's better to get rid of that stuff. ---

    Never said he shouldn't get rid of it. But scraping it brought the company very little money when they could have sold them on eBay for much more.


    they probably arent in the business of selling old junk on ebay. they'd have to pay someone to manage the selling of each individual unit and handle the entire process. my old company would donate them and get a tax break.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Zouf on Sun Apr 18 18:49:12 2021
    @VIA: BBSESINF
    @MSGID: <607CC578.4420.dove-gen@bbses.info>
    @REPLY: <607C53C9.25852.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c168
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Zouf to multiplemiggs on Sun Apr 18 2021 04:44 pm


    That's all note I'm sure I'll make a horrendous mess of a lot of damaged/broken boards before I become competent in any way, shape or form. I sure as hell won't be touching any genuine project machines this year as they'll require a steady hand. Again, I appreciate the advoce!

    the less time you spend on it the better too. if you are having problems put it down and come back later. you can heat up the area too much and lose a pad.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From multiplemiggs@VERT/BTTMLSS to Zouf on Mon Apr 19 00:43:00 2021
    @VIA: BTTMLSS
    @MSGID: <607D0A75.118683.dove-gen@vert.synchro.net>
    That's all note I'm sure I'll make a horrendous mess of a lot of damaged/b boards before I become competent in any way, shape or form. I sure as hell won't be touching any genuine project machines this year as they'll requir steady hand. Again, I appreciate the advoce!

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!

    Glad I could help you out. Just practice and you'll get the hang of it pretty quick.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to MRO on Mon Apr 19 08:05:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <607D7466.52055.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <607C190C.4411.dove-gen@bbses.info>
    @TZ: c12c
    MRO wrote to Ogg <=-

    i used to print a manual and then walk down to the corner store to get soda. i could hear my printer half a block away. ---

    One place I worked, I created a process where you could queue up things
    to print and then, after we had left for the day, it would print everything out. We just had to make sure we had a full box of paper in the printer.

    It worked out pretty good. Only a couple times did the paper get jammed.
    But it did scare the heck out of the security guard one night. 8)


    ... First, they tax incomes; now they're taxing my patience.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA
  • From Zouf@VERT/AMSTRAD to MRO on Tue Apr 20 00:50:13 2021
    @VIA: AMSTRAD
    @MSGID: <607E1735.25881.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @REPLY: <607CC578.4420.dove-gen@bbses.info>
    @TZ: 9000
    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: MRO to Zouf on Sun Apr 18 2021 06:49 pm

    Re: Re: TRS-80 Model 102
    By: Zouf to multiplemiggs on Sun Apr 18 2021 04:44 pm


    That's all note I'm sure I'll make a horrendous mess of a lot of damaged/broken boards before I become competent in any way, shape or form sure as hell won't be touching any genuine project machines this year as they'll require a steady hand. Again, I appreciate the advoce!

    the less time you spend on it the better too. if you are having problems pu

    Thanks. The last thing I want to do is be responsible for destroying old computers rather than maintaining them!

    ---
    Synchronet BBS for Amstrad computer users including CPC, PPC and PCW!
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Zouf on Mon Apr 19 07:11:00 2021
    @VIA: REALITY
    @MSGID: <607ED939.47450.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @REPLY: <607C5605.25853.dove-general@amstrad.simulant.uk>
    @TZ: c1e0
    Zouf wrote to Ogg <=-

    The dotmatrix printers must have been the next to the worst as
    far as noise was concerned. I really don't miss those machines
    at all.

    I've never heard any of the older Teletype or punch style printers
    other than on YouTube videos. When I first started school, the Dot
    Martix printers were getting phased out in favour of laser printer I
    still do remember the high pitched ear-splitting noises they made.


    My first IT gig was working with a midrange computer running the University bookstore. Every morning I'd come in, check out a list of print jobs, and print them out on 11x17 greenbar paper on a big line printer. it'd take
    about an hour to print and another 30 minutes to collate and distribute
    them. Thankfully the printer was in an enclosed raised-floor server room.

    Paper was king back then.




    ... All those updates, and still imperfect!
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    Synchronet realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Dr. What on Mon Apr 19 07:15:00 2021
    @VIA: REALITY
    @MSGID: <607ED939.47451.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @REPLY: <607D7466.52055.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @TZ: c1e0
    Dr. What wrote to MRO <=-

    One place I worked, I created a process where you could queue up things
    to print and then, after we had left for the day, it would print everything out. We just had to make sure we had a full box of paper in the printer.

    It worked out pretty good. Only a couple times did the paper get
    jammed. But it did scare the heck out of the security guard one night.
    8)

    Way back when, I had an old apartment with old wiring. I think the entire place was running on 2 20 amp circuits. I had a hand-me-down Apple Laserwriter, and I printed to it via serial port (since I had a PC). I'd
    queue up a print job, printing to the printer at 9600 baud, go in the other room, and in a couple of minutes when I saw the lights flicker, knew the printer was finally printing.


    ... All those updates, and still imperfect!
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    Synchronet realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From Dr. What@VERT/DMINE to poindexter FORTRAN on Wed Apr 21 07:47:00 2021
    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <60801434.52087.dove-general@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <607ED939.47451.dove.dove-gen@realitycheckbbs.org>
    @TZ: c12c
    poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Dr. What <=-

    Way back when, I had an old apartment with old wiring. I think the
    entire place was running on 2 20 amp circuits. I had a hand-me-down
    Apple Laserwriter, and I printed to it via serial port (since I had a
    PC). I'd queue up a print job, printing to the printer at 9600 baud, go
    in the other room, and in a couple of minutes when I saw the lights flicker, knew the printer was finally printing.

    Long ago, I knew someone who actually had a VAX in his apartment. He ran
    a BBS on it. When he did weekly maintenance, he had to power up each
    hard drive seperately and let it come to speed before doing the next one.
    If he didn't, he'd blow the circuit breaker.


    ... Women who wear mini-skirts sure are cheeky folk.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    Synchronet Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA